CB Radios

[Mikey Gribble]

I was looking into getting a few CB radios for communicating from car to car while chasing. I tried talking to the guy at Radio Shack, but he was pretty clueless on it. What kind of range can you expect? Is there any sort of amplifer you can get to boost your signal? And is there any brand or specific antenna that is well known for being high quality?

I have people tag along quite often and it would be great if I could keep in touch with them to notify them of upcoming turns and stuff like that. Also with the tour deal going on we may have two cars (if I ever manage to get a respectable amount of business) and then it would be a must.

I know ham radios are the way to go, but I really don't want to go take that class and I will have different drivers a lot of times so I won't have people that are certified to use ham radios anyway, so that isn't an option.

Any help would be greatly appreciated because I'm looking at getting some in the next couple weeks. I was just going to buy the handheld batter powered ones they have at Radio Shack unless somebody has any objections to that. I've always had really good luck with everything I've bought from there and the guy told me that handheld model I was looking at had the maximum output allowed so it should work just as well as any other. I'm sure the antenna and amplifers if they have them are what really matter, but I know nothing about that. Thanks in advance for any help.

[Jeff Smith]

Hey Mikey,
IMO you would have better luck with the FRS/GMRS hand helds. We have used them before and they have pretty good range, and IIRC, they are FM instead of AM, which would have a better sound and less suceptible to lightning interference...

[Mike Weiss]

Mikey, Who better to know about this than a truck driver....Anywho...I second the FRS radios...As long as you are with in sight of the second car or at least a mile through trees, etc...they will work for you. The CB option is ok, but as Jeff said, the sound would be better with the FRS radios...The only way for you to boost power on a CB is to "Peak and Tune" it. Which I do not believe that you can do with hand helds. As with any radio, the Ant. is the most important part. You can mount Ant's on your vehicle for better reception, if thats the route you wanna go. You can usually get 3-5 miles pretty easily with a CB, but you cant use an amplifier(Legally)!!!! According to FCC Regs, a CB can only have a Max of 4 Watts output.

Hope this helps...Mike

[Ric Burney]

I would look for MURS radios. They are VHF which is great for rural terrain, allows for external antennas which will increase distance and requires no license like HAM and GMRS. FRS is UHF which is better for urban environments and doesn't allow for external antennas or any other modification. Try http://www.popularwireless.com for more information. Hope this helps.

[Jesse Risley]

If you're really going to go with a CB radio, I would recommend Wilson antennas. You can get the magnetic mount versions, and they are stellar antennas. You will get better range with a CB radio and an external antenna than FRS handie talkies, but as others have mentioned, AM radio noise is an issue.

FRS seems to be the best option these days, namely because they are portable. You can get hand held CB radios, but the range on those are very poor. A good CB setup will involve a permanently installed mobile rig (or hand held) on some sort of an external antenna.

The FRS units are all portable, but the commercial handie talkies have no external antenna option. Their range is decent, but plan to troubleshoot battery life issues with spare batteries and/or a radio that will allow some sort of DC power.

[Benjamin Rock]

I used to be a radio tech. CB would be better distance wise(10+ miles), however, they pick up a lot of noise from lightning and powerlines. Also, many people have them and some are rather impolite with their use. Profanity, keying over someone else to be a jerk, things like that.

FRS/GMRS are good but for line-of-sight use. You may be able to get a mile or two out of the radio, but that's about it. There are no external antennas for these available on the market. Also, the GMRS frequencies require a license that will cost about $85 per license to operate.FRS is free. Noise wise, they are very quiet as they operate on the UHF band.

Hand Held CB-These are nice if you buy the cobra model. You can buy the mobile kit. It has a radio that can run on batts or be plugged in, an external magnet mount antenna, which will improve talk distance, and you can take it with you when you get out of the car.

MURS radios- These are not as widely used anymore and are hard to find. They work pretty good though if you can get them. No license required. distance is power and antenna dependent. about 10-30 miles talk distance.

Look at your local Wal-mart, Farm and Tractor supply store, or auto parts store for CB, FRS/GMRS radios for better deals. Radio shack is getting out of the HAM and CB stuff and it's a little more expensive.
All of the above can be "tuned,tweaked and peaked" at most radio shops. they all depend greatly on the antenna as well. Wilson is one of the best antenna makers. You can get magnet,permanent mount, or trunk mount models. Go to Copper Electronics for these. Hope this all helps.

[Joey Ketcham]

I disagree with the FRS/GMRS, I've owned various brands of handheld FRS/GMRS units and thought they were useless. The range sucked, even though they said a range of 5 miles. Yeah right. I say look into getting MURS radios, I have one and guys I chase with and I have used it successfully. MURS radio's aren't all that hard to find, you can find them on ebay..

http://shop.ebay.com/items/?_nkw=MURS+radio&_sacat=0&_trksid=p3286.m270.l1313&_odkw=MURS&_osacat=0

[Warren Faidley]

Your best bet for money and efficiency is to just go ahead and get a simple ham license and go with an inexpensive hand-held 2m radio, like a YAESU VX170, 5W 2M radio. It is simple to use, water resistant and has an option for AA batteries. Total cost under $140.00. You will be MUCH happier with a ham radio than any of the FRS or other noted radios. You can also call in spotter reports in many areas, not all, as some are private. (Don't get me started on this topic). In addition, many chasers use 2m frequencies to communicate with each other. The power and distance of a 2m (or 440, etc) radio is by far the best. By going through a local repeater, the distance is many, many miles. The only advantage of a CB is monitoring truckers. They can provide critical information about road closures, etc. I think many truckers have gone to FRS? CB's are also good entertainment as the conversations are often off the scale.

W.

[Jason Foster]

I disagree with Warren about getting the ham license. Ham Radio is not like CB, it is not meant to be all access. If you are not using ham radio for other things other than chasing, you shouldn't get it. Additionally, many are abusing the ham radio for use while they are chasing and conducting business. You cannot use Ham radio for you business which includes talking about positions and coordinating chase buddies for better camera angles and such when you end up selling such footage.

The best bet it to just stick with cell phones if distance is a problem and FRS for short range (yes, 5 miles is a stretch). CB to me is a waste of money. I've had them and never had any benefit from them. It is also just another distraction.

My advise is to just forget about CB and deal with what you got.

[Mike Weiss]

Mikey, Dont know much about it, but what about Nextel Direct connect? I dont know if you have to hit the tower then it goes to the other phone...Maybe something to check into..
Warren, most truckers dont even listen or use the CB anymore, Since XM and Sirius, that is. Alot use chat channels for the cell phone.

[Steve Polley]

Like has been said before, if you are conducting business with a ham radio, that is against FCC rules. GMRS radios are very nice if you are withing 5 miles or less and line of sight. In your situation, I would use MURS frequencies with some of the used commercial radios that are widely available now such as Motorola, Kenwood equipment. You will need a VHF radio that will cover the 150-174 VHF band. Of course there is maximum wattage limitations here too as well.

[Rob Wadsworth]

I would have to agree with Jason Foster.
If you are a Ham and you have the gear - then you are good to go. Provided the available frequencies in the area aren't being overrun. Not likely - though.

If you don't have a Ham license, then a CB is a good choice. It can transmit over a better distance than any handheld radio - because handheld radios have built-in limitations. "Rubber duck" antennas aren't very efficient, small batteries in the handheld limit power output, and the built-in mic isn't much of a performer.

CB's?
As one poster said on this thread, a Wilson 1000 is an excellent antenna. I have/use one myself - a great way to go. Don't settle for less, as a good antenna will make even a poor radio receive/transmit farther. If you want to get a good CB, stay with a decent brand - such as Cobra, Ranger, Galaxy, Uniden, and even Realistic ("Radio Shack"). Be prepared to spend about $100-125 for any one of these used/new. The Uniden radios can be had for cheaper and are really quite outstanding for the money. The Wilson 1000 will run about $75/new and $50/used - worth the money too - IMO. If you want to ask me any specific questions about CB makes or models good/better/best, send me a PM and I will reply.

I am going to put in a CB with my Ham/2 meter radio this season. I have a Ranger TR 696 FD-1 with a Turner Road King mic and a Wilson 1000 antenna. The 2 meter radio is a Yaesu FT-8800R and a Diamond antenna. The Yaesu has a built-in scanner with limited functions, so I will need to get a dedicated scanner for next season - God willing...
:D

[Dave Marshall]

I would say that GMRS is a good way to go, as with the license (a couple hundred bucks I think?) radios can legally run up to 50 watts.

To clarify what Jason said, it actually isn't necessarily illegal to sell video taped while ham radio was being used to coordinate. 98% of storm chasers atleast stay within the letter of the law, if not the exact intent.

A violation only occurs one of two ways.

First scenario, you are actively on payroll and coordinating activities/passing information related to the completion of your hired duties (IE you are on Channel 5's payroll, and something like "Gary says we need a second angle for the broadcast package, You swing west on that county road, and I'll hang tight here"). This can be an ugly gray area, as I'm sure you can imagine.

OR, you are physically being paid to use the radio (IE you're collecting money for time spent passing traffic over ham radio, such as disaster relief).

The act of storm chasing/skywarn spotting that happens to produce video you can later sell (Be careful with pre-contracted work and coordination associated with it) isn't by the FCCs strictest definition, a violation of Part 97. It really does depend on your intent when chasing the storm (how many of us would stay home if the TV station declined our video? Not many, and even fewer are on a payroll to chase), and your employed status. The nature of the communication creates that gray area. If you're out chasing because you love storms and want some great video, but with no specific buyer in mind, where is the line drawn between commercial and hobby use? The FCC generally sticks to a very specific scenario in order to sidestep these areas of questionable intent.

[Jesse Risley]

If you really want the range and clarity of FM amateur radio, without the licensing process and possible "gray" areas of operating on ham in conjunction with business purposes, MURS is arguably your best alternative. Your range is very similar to amateur radio, minus the allowable power output (50+ watts on ham mobiles), and you can use an external antenna and/or stick with handy talkies.

CB would be my second best choice, although others have already pointed out the cons of going that route. FRS is fine for short range communications, but you won't get 3-4+ mile range inside of cars using those low power handy talkies with no external antenna options.

[Mikey Gribble]

Man that's a lot of repsonses. I just logged on and expected a few replies at best. Thanks for everybodys help.
I want a handheld unit that connects to an external antenna. I think CB or the MURS options are looking good for what I'm planning on doing with them based off what everybody is saying.
I agree on Wilson antennas. I've had several of them and absolutely loved them. They are always my first choice.
I'll shop around and look at both options. I also want to see if the radio shack CB will hook up fine with a Wilson antenna, which I'm sure it will or I can just get an adapter. That would be an easy cheap route to take.
If we are seperated by more than 5 miles or so we can always switch over to cell phones. If we don't have a signal then I guess we're just screwed lol.
It would just be really nice to talk back and forth regularly from cars to point out storm features. I've also almost had a few accidents when we turned on to a non mait. road and slid uncontrollably in the mud. We were waiving frantically for the people following us not to turn on the road, but of course they did and damn near slid into us. That has happened more than once and could be easily avoided with a radio.
thanks again for all your help. I really appreciate it.

[Joe Dorn]

Your best bet for money and efficiency is to just go ahead and get a simple ham license and go with an inexpensive hand-held 2m radio, like a YAESU VX170, 5W 2M radio. It is simple to use, water resistant and has an option for AA batteries. Total cost under $140.00. You will be MUCH happier with a ham radio than any of the FRS or other noted radios. You can also call in spotter reports in many areas, not all, as some are private. (Don't get me started on this topic). In addition, many chasers use 2m frequencies to communicate with each other. The power and distance of a 2m (or 440, etc) radio is by far the best. By going through a local repeater, the distance is many, many miles. The only advantage of a CB is monitoring truckers. They can provide critical information about road closures, etc. I think many truckers have gone to FRS? CB's are also good entertainment as the conversations are often off the scale.

W.

I have to agree with Warren's assessment of the radio choices since it is very similar to my set up.

I am very active in the local emergency communications activities and teach amateur radio classes several times a year. I am also a mentor with the ARRL Emergency Communications Courses with almost 200 students to my credit and a Volunteer Examiner for the amateur radio tests.

I am amazed at the support on this forum for FRS that I have found to be adequate for parking lot control and little else. There are also compatibility issues between radios from different manufacturers. The repeater network for the other services is limited and the radios will cost as much if not more than the amateur radio equivalent.

CB radios are a great source of road information that you are not going to get anywhere else. We spend a lot of time on the Interstates; CB and Street Atlas have saved us many hours of dead time on the highways. Some of the language is below par but not much worse than you hear in the local movie house. I don’t leave home without my CBs.

The big downer: CB is AM which is subject to deafening lightning noise and might be useless near a big storm system. 5 to 10 miles is the outside range limit for legal CB's.

As to the commercial use of amateur radio, there are ongoing discussions as to where the line needs to be drawn. I have had to face this issue several times with our 16 hospital amateur radio network and hams that work for the hospitals. Each ham has to evaluate his use of the radio in relation to his job.

In Warren’s case and many others; shooting photographs for sale is not an illegal use of amateur radio. If this was not acceptable then the many authors of amateur radio books and articles would be in trouble. Ask yourself if you are directly being paid or remunerated to use the radio.

In Warren's case, if he uses amateur radio to coordinate his caravan of 'pay to play' tourist chasers, then he is illegally using the radio. He would be most welcome to make storm reports on our wide area repeater with EchoLink connection to the NWS in Fort Worth.

Cell phones certainly have their place in the communications network BUT they are the first to go in disaster situations either due to cell failure or overload. BTW, tornados have been known to create disasters. FTW has limited inbound telephone lines for storm reports with no one assigned full tme to that function. There are about a dozen hams available to run the FTW amateur radio network. They are unpaid volunteers.

As far as the amateur radio tests go, anyone that is capable of understanding the basics of meteorology should have little problem preparing for the Technician license. Manuals are available from arrl.org, amateur radio stores and amazon.com. Practice tests are available at http://www.eham.net/exams/ and http://www.qrz.com/p/testing.pl. Testing locations and dates can also be found at arrl.org. If you are in the Central Texas area, contact me and I will arrange for your test.

BTW, I also share Warren's distaste for the 'closed' repeater systems put together by a bunch of ham snobs...


When all else fails, amateur radio is still there....

[Jason Foster]

......To clarify what Jason said, it actually isn't necessarily illegal to sell video taped while ham radio was being used to coordinate. 98% of storm chasers atleast stay within the letter of the law, if not the exact intent......


Yes, Dave, thanks for further clarifying that point. I should have, but the post was getting a little long.

Bottom line, it's the use of the radio to profit from vs. just running a business while on the radio. Big difference.

Think of a plumber...it's OK for him/her to talk on a radio while heading to a customer location, but if he receives or transmits advertising, or communicates with a dispatcher for his job, it's illegal.

Yes, most do stay within the lines, but it was worth mentioning because of so many getting a license.

[Jerry Prsha]

I bought a Cobra 75 WX ST and have the NWS on that while I scan the repeaters with a Scanner. And as someone mentioned, the trucks pass along a lot of info as to police shooting radar, much further away than a radar detector ever could.

It was worth the cost in the long run having the whole radio on the handset.