Spotternetwork Reporting Question

[Bill Tabor]

I was attempting to make a Spotternetwork report the other day in the field and had a bit of trouble. Problem was I was on a slow connection and Spotternetwork wants me to first flag the position of the incident via Google maps and a pin that you move around. Problem was Google maps when it initializes is zoomed out all the way to national view. It took me forever with a lot of persistence to get Google maps to zoom in and then find my position and move the pin. I had to do this about 5 or 6 times at lowering zoom levels and wait each time while Spotternetwork determined the locations of the pin for reporting. The whole time I was looking at the computer rather than the storm activity I was trying to monitor outside the vehicle.

Question: Is there a quicker way of doing this? Am I just missing something here. One thought I have is that Spotternetwork could initialize the Google maps and the pin for the activity report in the current location of the Spotter via gps and zoom to an appropriate level so that the pin could quickly be repositioned up to 20 miles or so for accuracy. I looked for a quicker interface than the online website form but didn't see anything. How do the rest of you do this, and how much of an issue has this been for anyone else?

[Jeff Snyder]

Bill,

Did you have a GPS running? If you do, then your position should be automatically entered without any need to pin it on the Google Maps, IIRC. If you don't have the GPS up, you can try to use GRx or StreetAtlas to get your lat/lon, then put SpotterNetwork into "Manual" mode, enter your lat/lon, then submit a report.

Then again, I thought Tyler did away with Google Maps when submitting reports? Ah, wait, are you submitting a report by going to spotternetwork.org first, as opposed to using the "Submit a Report" button in the application? Tyler streamlined the page that you are brought to when you hit "Submit a Report" to make it relatively small and friendly for cell connections.

[Tony Perkins]

You need the spotter network client Bill.

http://www.spotternetwork.org/latest_SNclient.zip

[Skip Talbot]

Does the new beta client let you submit reports through the client itself? I was out on Saturday and tried to report two inch hail. My connection was so spotty though I couldn't wait for the page to load before I had to move. It would be nice if you could fill out the fields in the client and just hit send, instead of loading a separate page.

[Andrew Revering]

No it doesn't. But the page it pulls up is pure text. It cant be more than 10kb.

[Skip Talbot]

Yeah, I know its a small amount of data to transfer, but its the seek time that does it. I have to wait for it to establish a connection with the server. If my data is out then I will never get that page. It would be nice if I could enter the data first and then the client software would try several times on its own to connect and send it. That way I don't have to sit there trying to get a webpage to load, and can spend my time bailing out of the two inch hail core.

[Andrew Revering]

I'll have to run this one past Tyler.

[Ben Holcomb]

It might even be helpful if you can fill out a report in the client, and have it queue up and report it later when you get signal again.

We had the same problems on Saturday. No data in NW OK.

[Jeff Snyder]

It might even be helpful if you can fill out a report in the client, and have it queue up and report it later when you get signal again.

We had the same problems on Saturday. No data in NW OK.

I second this idea. If nothing else, you'll only need a connection to send the report itself, not the web page + report. I imagine all you'd need is a pop-up window in the client with some drop-down boxes and a couple of text boxes for descriptions. Even though the page is only 10 kb, it may be the 'make or break' when data connections are unreliable. In addition, I like the idea of having it "queue up" and submit automatically when it detects a valid internet connection. Perhaps send something back from the server to the client to confirm that the report was successfully submitted.

[Andrew Revering]

That's exactly right... that's how it would have to be to confirm the data was received successfully by the server.

I would argue though that in the case that you don't have data to report a 'reportable condition', you should be calling in the report or using the Ham as an alternative means of communication.

[Bill Tabor]

In answer to the questions of a few of you: Yes I did have a gps connection and gps was functioning at the time. I chose submit a report in the app and it brought me to the web page that had the Google Map app and the pin to move. Perhaps my Spotternet client was old (since last Spring). The night after the event I downloaded the latest from Spotternetwork.org. Currently using version 2.2. Not sure if that was the same as what I had. I think it may have been 1.2 or something. So perhaps it is improved. Next day after loading the new version I clicked submit a report (just to check) and it looked similar. Of course I didn't go through all the steps since I didn't have anything to report at the time.

As for the rest of the thread conversation...yeah I agree with the rest of you and was kind of thinking the queue and submit as able was how it already worked. That is a great idea, and best way to do IMO from the client - quick - submit and forget and move on to the next storm feature. I have an Iphone and I noticed that when I was in an area where the network couldn't send it would stage it in the 'Outbox' and wait for the network connect and then it would send. Seems to work well.

Maybe I should use the Beta? What do you all recommend for actual in the field reporting?

[Bill Tabor]

I might add that after my initial reporting event (non-tornadic) I had a tornado to report but didn't until 20 minutes later due to the trouble I had earlier. I knew I didn't have that long to try. Course I tried my NWS phone number and that apparently was old and didn't work, then I tried 911, and they told me to call the local non-911 number next time. :confused::D Heck I tried to help out. They never did issue a tornado warning. Between the Spottnetwork and trying to stream video and keep my stream up with all other chasing tasks I had very little time to actually observe the storm. I will have to reevaluate all this stuff. I miss the days of just watching the storms. Plus I know I missed key features and clues because I as so distracted.

[Andrew Revering]

Tyler and I discussed the option to put the reporting into the app, but decided against it for a couple reasons:

1) The logistics of keeping the form in the program up to date with the latest formatting for submission is a bit hairy. Its much more difficult than updating a web page.

2) If you cannot submit a report in a timely manner online, it should be done by other means.

[Skip Talbot]

1) The logistics of keeping the form in the program up to date with the latest formatting for submission is a bit hairy. Its much more difficult than updating a web page.

How sbout downloading the webpage form locally through the client software at the start of the client software. That way the latest submission form is used and there will be no loading times for each report. The spotter is most likely going to have a decent connection when they start the application so downloading that updated page shouldn't be a problem like it might be once out in the field.


2) If you cannot submit a report in a timely manner online, it should be done by other means.

Reporting via ham radio and cell phone is great for fixed base spotters. The real beauty of having GPS integrated reporting software, is that I can submit a detailed report with specific time and location information instantly from any location. Reporting via ham or cell is equally cumbersome for a chaser and more cumbersome than online reporting. It requires finding the correct frequency or number and then trying to convince a party that doesn't know you that your report is legitimate. Besides the local skywarn nets are going to want you to check in first and then you'll probably be dealing with a lot of other traffic. The NWS offices and 911 centers are also going to be extremely busy, so getting that call through is going to be iffy. A lot of chasers are simply not going to bother with reporting if they can't just hit the button to have their report go through.

[Andrew Revering]

How sbout downloading the webpage form locally through the client software at the start of the client software.

Ok... good solution. Maybe this idea still has a chance to get through our politics. ;-)

[John Wetter]

If you can't submit a report 'now' via spotternetwork, you should be reporting it via other means. If the report doesn't need to go in 'now', then I'd say report it when you get home via eSpotter. That's my opinion on the matter having worked with all modes of reporting...

[Matthew Fischer]

Does the new beta client let you submit reports through the client itself? I was out on Saturday and tried to report two inch hail. My connection was so spotty though I couldn't wait for the page to load before I had to move. It would be nice if you could fill out the fields in the client and just hit send, instead of loading a separate page.


Skip remember you lead us to the 2 inch hail on the other side of Foss Lake! I know on sunday i had trouble loading the web page to report the wall cloud near Ok 152 and 6. Plus doesn't help that we didn't have an amp. plus doesn't help gps gate was being stupid by turning red all the time! Another thing to figure out too.

[Tyler Allison]

If you can't submit a report 'now' via spotternetwork, you should be reporting it via other means. If the report doesn't need to go in 'now', then I'd say report it when you get home via eSpotter. That's my opinion on the matter having worked with all modes of reporting...

You can also submit "old" reports via the SN. Just make sure you select the proper time on the report so it gets placed in the proper location within the database and is referenced as such. Some folks have submitted old reports but forget to change the time, but then in the notes say that it's old.

[Bill Tabor]

Yeah same problem happened to me yesterday using the 2.2 client. When I clicked 'Submit Report' in the client it brought me to the web page that was on the Spotternetwork login screen. From there I had to choose 'Make a Report' or whatever link it is called. That brought up the Google map app zoomed all the way out and it took forever on my slow connection - which I noticed seems slower near severe storms. I reported a wallcloud over Guthrie, Tx but I subbed it nearly an hour late. That wasn't because of the software though I knew it would be slow...it was because the storm was intense and it was very dark / black where I was an I was trying to keep from getting eaten.

But yeah, to use this easily and consistently it needs some improvement. I checked and it showed my IP Geo lat/long as somewhere in Ohio? I am using a Delorme Earthmate via USB and gps was working. I'm not sure if my Pantech USB wireless modem supports gps. My old Sierra Wireless did. Is that what is required in order to make it recognise my position? And, if so how is the process different then? Will it bring my position up and zoomed down to the appropriate level? So you see it isn't just the form...if Google Maps can initialize with the proper coordinates and zoomed in at a proper level to move the pin that would then be no problem IMO and it would work well I think.

[Tyler Allison]

If the SN client is connected to your GPS then when you click 'Submit Report' it will _not_ show you the google map but instead a pure text version of the report screen with your exact position already filled in. You just click a few times for what the report is and hit submit.

[Bill Tabor]

That's definitely not what happened to me last night when I tried it. Is this an Earthmate issue? Have you tested this. As I stated when I clicked it it brought me to the website where I had to log in, then choose the proper link for reporting on the left side of the page, and then the Google map with no gps info. I promise I am not making this up.

Perhaps I should uninstall and then reinstall? It says I have version 2.2. I didn't uninstall the old one first - perhaps I should have?

Perhaps I'll hook it up and test in a minute again. If I'm not chasing. Doesn't seem like ma nature is in a hurry to do anything severe today.

[Tyler Allison]

It's not an earth mate issue. I've setup several folks with earthmates and not had this problem.

It definitely works as I described unless something is off on the client end. I've used it multiple times as described.

Send me an email with your SN ID# and I'll check the logs. I can usually tell what's going wrong that way. It should _never_ ask you to login when you click 'Submit Report' if your client is properly configured. The fact that you had to login _after_ clicking 'Submit Report' suggests something is not right.

-Tyler

[Steve Polley]

It's not an earth mate issue. I've setup several folks with earthmates and not had this problem.

It definitely works as I described unless something is off on the client end. I've used it multiple times as described.

Send me an email with your SN ID# and I'll check the logs. I can usually tell what's going wrong that way. It should _never_ ask you to login when you click 'Submit Report' if your client is properly configured. The fact that you had to login _after_ clicking 'Submit Report' suggests something is not right.

-Tyler

Tyler, lately I have been having the same issue as well. It now asks me to login and drop the pin in google maps where to identify the report.

[Tyler Allison]

That's actually a good thing. Now I have two data points to try and find a common issue. email me your SN # (tyler@spotternetwork.org)

It should not be working that way.

[Tyler Allison]

Well...seems I need to eat a little bit of crow.

There was a bug in the code that was causing an issue with the auto-location reporting action as I described above.

If folks could double check I'd appreciate it.

Just bring up your SN client and set Manual or GPS and click 'Submit Report'. It should _NOT_ require you to login or show a google map so long as you have a valid lat/lon

[Bill Tabor]

Mine is working perfect now Tyler. I thought it was what I did though, but now that I log in to tell you I see that you may have changed something. I removed both versions on my computer. (Yes, it showed 2 in Add/Remove Programs). I made sure the directories were gone, and I killed all the shortcuts, and desktop icons as well. Next I killed the download versions in my temp folder and then downloaded the latest from the website where it created a new extract folder and I extracted to new location. I then installed and reset my spotter id went out in the field (where I am now), and got a Millenicom wireless connection, connected my gps, went active and clicked 'Submit Report'. As you mentioned it went to the abbreviated webpage form and already had my location sited via the lat / long of the gps - correctly. I had the option to go to the high bandwidth which I did, and after a few moments it brought up the Google Map with the pin located in the correct position as desired. Bravo! I like it.

My only suggestion would be to have 1 more zoom level of resolution when the map loads. I had to click '+' one time on the scale to the left to manage the pin in an area where I would be seeing storm features (certainly within 20 miles or so). I think that would be an improvement, but clicking on it one time wasn't so big a deal. Yep, pretty cool. Now if I only had a storm to report on tonight - Alas!

Another thought...when in OK (or was it near Guthrie, Tx) the website said my CWA doesn't accept Espotter reports so I was also wondering if that would affect anything. The location I am in now does and also provides their contact number.

Anyway, thanks for looking into this.

[Tyler Allison]

Another thought...when in OK (or was it near Guthrie, Tx) the website said my CWA doesn't accept Espotter reports so I was also wondering if that would affect anything.

Just means that the SN has not been authorized by that office to submit reports to them via eSpotter for some reason. We still take the report and distribute where we can like the various feeds, NWSChat, etc

I wouldn't let that stop you submitting the report.

[Dan Cook]

Check out the Indiana report; "lots of lightning".

[APritchard]

This is only partially related, but I noticed a few times (maybe all?) that when I, or others would submit a "rotating wall cloud" the report would come out as a "NON-rotating wall cloud". This creates some funky reports with a Non-Rotating Wall cloud being described in the note as having rapid/violent rotation with a tornado imminent.

Do we have some wires crossed?

[Jeff Snyder]

Check out the Indiana report; "lots of lightning".

I like this one:
Reported By: Daniel Starks
Other - See Note
Time: 2009-05-02 20:17:00 UTC
Notes: Heavy Rain

:rolleyes::eek: Well duh - there's a storm above you! No mention of flooding or extraordinary rainfall rates that may be of use to spotters, chasers, or operational meteorologists.

I've heard about the 'all wall-clouds reported as non-rotating' issue before, but I haven't run into it myself, and I've seen a few 'rotating wall-cloud' reports in the past week. I assume you making sure to change the box to "Rotating wall-cloud" from "Non-rotating wall-cloud" (which is the default option)?

[Chad Cowan]

I like this one:
Reported By: Daniel Starks
Other - See Note
Time: 2009-05-02 20:17:00 UTC
Notes: Heavy Rain

:rolleyes::eek: Well duh - there's a storm above you! No mention of flooding or extraordinary rainfall rates that may be of use to spotters, chasers, or operational meteorologists.


This same guy made a report shortly after that of "Sirens going off".

[Tyler Allison]

This is only partially related, but I noticed a few times (maybe all?) that when I, or others would submit a "rotating wall cloud" the report would come out as a "NON-rotating wall cloud". This creates some funky reports with a Non-Rotating Wall cloud being described in the note as having rapid/violent rotation with a tornado imminent.

Do we have some wires crossed?

Yes. People are not taking the time to check the "Rotating" wall cloud option. The default is "Not" rotating.